Karen The Supertrader from Tastytrade: Is Karen Bruton the Supertrader a FRAUD?
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Karen The Supertrader from Tastytrade: Is Karen Bruton the Supertrader a FRAUD?


Karen the Super trader. Hey I’m gonna make this quick video on
Karen the Supertrader or Karen Bruton and she also has the name Karen the super
trader she’s put out by tastytrade as you know kind of a symbol of what it’s
like and the best way that you should trade options and she’s put out there as
almost like she’s put out on the pedestal where she was they were told
people were told who follow tastytrade that she was able to turn apparently
$100,000 into $41 million in three years and it looks so the SEC charged her and
they charged her with fraud I can I know that she paid a fine and that she was
also banned from the business but the point is that you have to be extremely
careful on the on who you’re getting your information from when you see
something like Tacey works which I believe is doing a positive service by
teaching people how to sell option premium but in then at the same time
they are giving access to people who I believe are scams and frauds like
Timothy Sykes who has appeared on tastytrade Network multiple times and
then also carrying the super trader who instead of turning a hundred thousand
dollars into forty 1 million the SEC claim that she actually lost 50 million
dollars and I’ll show you some of that evidence in a few minutes but the point
is that why should you care about it and really I wouldn’t even make this video
unless I believed that there was something wrong with the tastytrade
methodology and the reason why Karen lost so much money or quote-unquote
careened the super trader lost so much money is the same reason why I believe
Tom sahs knob does not make money trading in the same reason why I don’t
believe Thomas Asaf is a successful trader the reason is that when you are
wrong directionally and when you are short bias and have negative Delta it is
similar to you collecting premium on cars that
eventually end up becoming totaled and you end up paying the entire amount to
replace the car so for example if you’re an insurance company in an ideal
situation you want to collect premium for that car and then you don’t want
that car to get into any accidents but if you are wrong directionally then it
is very similar to you being an insurance company collecting the premium
for that policy and then having all of your cars get into collisions and
becoming totaled so therefore you have to pay out of pocket to replace that car
it’s almost like you’re collecting and you’re trading dollars for nickels and
that’s exactly the same thing that happen with Karen the supertrader why
she lost fifty million dollars and this is also why I don’t believe that Tom’s
Asaf makes money because even if you’re right when you’re short calls the
maximum amount of money that you can make is that you collect and you keep
the premium that you originally sold the options for however if you’re wrong
directionally then you are actually collecting that premium but it’s costing
you dollars and it’s only a matter of time just like with Karen Bruton that
you will go bankrupt and you’re gonna have to resort to shady things in order
to cover your tracks the weird thing is that even though she was indicted by the
SEC so here you can see tastytrade is still promoting her so we can see that
here so here so the weird thing is in the previous thing that I showed you
right here she’s talking about here she’s SEC charge fund manager her former
CPA she apparently turned a hundred thousand dollars into forty 1 million
and now she’s the front person for an old person’s home where she’s saying
that heritage provides her with the obligation of relieving her from the
obligation of bills and cooking I mean it’s kind of strange for someone
who apparently was able to turn a hundred thousand dollars into 41 million
now going back to this so she was fined one point five million dollars by the
SEC for fraud and she was also banned from the industry I believe if I read it
correctly let me see so she was charged with deceiving
investors of 50 million dollars in losses from 2014 and 2016 they pocketed
millions of dollars in undeserved incentive fees again look she lost 50
million dollars but at the same time tastytrade was promoting her as being
one of their most successful students the judgment was issued I mean she’s
very lucky that she wasn’t charged by the Department of Justice for criminal
fraud I’m not sure why she wasn’t the Commission temporarily suspended her
from doing business as accountants or investment advisors she engaged in a
continuous pattern of trading to inflate their compensation from the funds they
not only delayed realization of trading losses but also intentionally seized or
sized certain traits of the funds who realize the profit every month so pretty
much it was fraud the super ferret is winning strategy relied on fright now
look I don’t really believe everything that’s reported in the news I think that
the news is put out there for clickbait but when it’s signed by a judge and
you’re convicted and you’re fined and you had the ability to fight these
charges and you know there was a conviction or there was a settlement
agreement and you’re charged and you pay 1.5 million dollars to me then that’s
something that is worthwhile for you to pay attention to so allegedly she was
charged with deceiving investors and having 50 million dollars in losses and
she was charged with fraud SEC complaint violating anti-fraud provisions she’s being investigated for fraud now
here’s the weird thing about this where Karen the super trader I think just last
month she was invited to a tastytrade symposium and she actually gave a speech
SEC guru leaks SEC obtains consent judgment against let me see would SEC
obtains consent judgment against Karen supertrader Bruton she’d order she
would order – yeah so apparently she was ordered to pay it like a 1.5 million
dollar penalty with respect to alleged scheme avoiding fifty million dollars
plus and losses while earning millions in fees to which she was not entitled Karen the super trader so yeah Karen the
supertrader who apparently lost who apparently turned a hundred thousand
dollars into forty 1 million in reality she lost around fifty million dollars she certainly outsmarted the trade tasty
tards that’s interesting never heard that that word before all right let me
see but the here’s the weird thing tastytrade continues to give Karen
access to her their platform I think it was July 2019
let me see yep so geeks on parade here you can see the geeks on parade so Karen
just less than a month ago actually she was actually speaking at a symposium
to give advice to tasty critters this just doesn’t make sense to me why are
you gonna give this woman who’s convicted and led to pay a civil penalty
of 1.5 million dollars why are you going to give her acces why is she viewed as
someone who’s successfully in the industry when she was accused and
charged with losing 50 million dollars she did not turn $100,000 into 41
million and she’s giving look at this they’re
giving her access to their networking they’re holding her up in a marketing
her as a successful trader when in reality she’s anything about that
successful traders do not get charged by the SEC for fraud
successful investors do not lose 50 million dollars successful investors do
not have to pay a civil penalty penalty of 1.5 million dollars look what she’s
saying successful investors neither tied to advertisements to get paid
promotional money to say that they do no longer have to worry about taking care
of their bills or life I quit my job also I actually like listen to this and
I don’t really get the impression that caring takes care of herself because
mentally she doesn’t seem extremely sharp
she’s fumbling over her words she’s looking down at the paper which leads me
to believe that she doesn’t have the mental capacity to process information
and to keep multiple amounts of information in her head and she doesn’t
have the verbal fluidity in order to deliver a speech in a coherent manner as
a result to me that would be a red flag and I also in my opinion get the same
thing when I watched someone like bill Paulus from profits run research where I
look at some of his presentation skills and it’s clear to me that again in my
opinion he is lacking intellectually so why would I want to take any advice from
someone who I do not believe have the mental faculties to be able to process
information let me also show you Timothy Sykes
who in my opinion is a scam artist yet tastytrade for some reason repeatedly
provides him with access to their program 2012 2011 2009 that doesn’t say
on Twitter replaces pencil so alright at least twice you have 2012 2011
tastytrade is granting access to Timothy sites which is kind of weird because if
you type in this I think Emmet from from trading schools
org you can see that he came out with a few hilarious and funny pieces on
Timothy Sykes so he calls him the turd economist he rates him quality cost
about 1.5 the only thing he gives them a 5-4 is charitable causes but look
Timothy Sykes is not Robin Hood he’s not I don’t think he should be giving credit
for taking money from innocent people and then transferring it to charities
that he then markets himself to make him look very benevolent this isn’t a
transfer of wealth the fact is in my opinion that teaching people how to
trade penny stocks is going to result in losses for almost everyone who does it
alright you can also see that Tim used to run profit Lee I believe he sold it
I’m not a hundred percent sure but you can also see where Emmet caught profit
Lea leaving fake reviews for other people when we see here’s profit Lee sorry that it’s not rendering perfectly
sprinkles the truth can sometimes be found a prophet li the verification of
brokerage accounts a properly is easily gamed and cannot be trusted
so here you see Tim Sykes let’s talk about prophet Li so can properly be
trusted it’s one big marketing snowball he’s properly a fraud so then I think
you can also see how Cameron Foust was caught with prophet Li from training
school org let me see all right in anyway so at best properly
has a dubious reputation from people who are serious about reviewing these sites
a lot of the positive reviews are done by affiliates so at best properly has a
dubious reputation properly was I believe started by Timothy Sykes Timothy
Sykes at best has a dubious reputation Timothy Sykes was given access to
tastytrade and a tastytrade platform multiple times has Timothy Sykes been
charged with a crime he was not however this does not bode well for the overall
validity and the overall reputation of tastytrade then tastytrade continuously
markets Karen Bruton the super trader even though she has been shown to be
fraudulent she was charged by the SEC for losing fifty million dollars she did
not turn $100,000 into 41 million dollars even as recently as July 2019
she was invited to a tastytrade symposium geeks parade in order to be
marketed by tastytrade for their methodology and for the way that they
teach you I can tell you that in my opinion I do not believe that Tom Safa
is a profitable trader primarily because when you are short Delta you are trading
dollars for nickels so anyone out there who believes that you should trade often
trade small definitely do that but trade small trade often trading often is going
to get you in trouble and look I’ll use TC I used to so I use tasty works as
well I love it I think it’s great as you can see we’re up around
I don’t know seventy five percent on the year and I use I use them all the time
but what I can tell you is I do not subscribe to the methodology of tasty
trade which is trade small trade often if you see here
we have I think we have yeah we have no losing trades for the entire year year
to date here the realized law there realized gains rather here the
unrealized gains we have positions on PayPal Raytheon and United Healthcare
here are all the realized gains here are the open positions that we have PayPal
Raytheon United Healthcare so even though I like tasty works I do not
subscribe to the tastytrade methodology I also think it’s incredibly shady that
they market someone with a dubious history who has been charged by the SEC
for fraud even though they continuously promote her as a model of consistency
and as a model that their followers should strive towards emulating but I do
not think I want to emulate someone who has lost 50 million dollars even though
she’s been marketed to someone who was able to turn a hundred thousand dollars
into 41 million so again besides the fact that it’s been shown numerous times
that Thomas on off frequently loses track of his positions he you know for
someone like yourself if you have anywhere from two thousand to five
million dollars I don’t know about you but it doesn’t make sense for me and it
would give me a lot of stress to lose track of my positions it’s not a game so
frequently you’ll see Tom and Tony laugh on set even though there are positions
that are going against them I don’t know why they think it’s a game because if
I’m losing track of my positions which Tom he’s admitted on his show that he
does and then you have a position going against you to me if I have a losing
position then I’m not happy about it so I would definitely you know if you want
to look at tastytrade for entertainment purposes no problem but if you follow
them religiously then in my opinion you’re going to lose money additionally
I did receive actually I think I’ve posted this on LinkedIn from a student who said that he lost he
was able to churn his account from 25,000 into 10,000 so here’s what I
posted another options trading education core success all right so this guy took
the course and where do you write about okay so he he said I just finished the
course the content is excellent I pretty much wasted the past nine years I
started off trading options in 2010 I finally started selling spreads where’s
the tastytrade part right here I transitioned to tastytrade and followed
their mantra trade small trade often and managed to trade my twenty five thousand
dollar account to ten thousand so I quit altogether for a while again this person
started off with twenty five thousand dollars and then they turned it into ten
thousand by following the tastytrade methodology of trade small trade often
then you have Karen the super trader who was charged with fraud by the SEC she
was able to agree to a settlement they accuse her of losing 50 million dollars
she paid a 1.5 million dollar fine they also have used Timothy Sykes and granted
him access to their platform you know it’s just
and look I use tastytrade as I showed you before I used tastytrade but I don’t
trade often you can see like all the trades these are you know the trade
these are for the entire year these are the symbols some of them have been very
small trades you can look at our entire portfolio right now we only have
positions on three three underlines and that’s pretty much it so if you have any
questions let me know so this is in my opinion the real truth
about Karen Bruton Karen the super trader this is David Jaffee with BestStockStrategy.com please like comment share and subscribe leave a comment
below I read everyone’s comments I appreciate your attention and if you
have any questions I’m here to help you

About Ralph Robinson

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47 thoughts on “Karen The Supertrader from Tastytrade: Is Karen Bruton the Supertrader a FRAUD?

  1. What is your angle? Sounds like you have an ax to grind with Karen (The Super Trader) and Tom (from Tastyworks) but you only have one-sided information. In your next video, provide research highlighting your bias and toss up some charts instead of opinion. ~Thanks

  2. Omg man Ive spent hours watching her interviews… never once though to check sources….thank you for bringing this to light for stupid me.

  3. It's a great story that Karen the super trader was able to turn $100,000 into $41 million but as you always say it's hard to trade your dollars for nickels and expect to make money.

  4. Do you think it's harder for older people like Karen the super trader to be profitable traders? I watched the video, and she does seem slow. And… she just entered an old person's home. That doesn't give me confidence.

  5. Why wasn't Karen hit with criminal charges for fraud? She lost $50 million and stole from people who believed in her.

  6. Some additional information from recent court filings: "The amended complaint alleges a recurring and egregious fraudulent scheme perpetrated

    by the Respondents. The scheme trades were ongoing and the defendants collected millions in

    unearned fees as a result of their fraudulent actions. Am. Com pl. ,I 113. The Respondents acted

    with a high level of sci enter; the Scheme Trades were intentional and designed to cover up losses

    and show a "profit" to investors each month. Am. Com pl. i[Cfl 60-70. ( 4 ). But in addition to the

    egregious underlying conduct, most importantly, the Respondents have not provided any sincere

    assurances that they will not engage in securities laws violations in the future."

  7. Pending request to bar her permanently: "Division respectfully requests that its motion for summary disposition of this

    action be granted, and that an order be issued barring Bruton from practicing before the

    Commission, barring Bruton from the securities industry, and censuring Hope."

  8. She did not turn 100k into 41 Million. She turned 100k to 150k in year one then went on to raise capital. once she was set up and using millions of investors capital her firm's returns were only in the 20-25% at the beginning before losing millions when the market began the bull run. Ive watched lots of her interviews and honestly she seemed pretty ill informed on strategy. Im not sure why she is touted as super successful on tasty trade.

  9. When I watched her a few months ago chatting with the tasty trade guys and I heard her crazy returns , boom, another “genius “ who’s either lying or taking humongous risk therefore going down really hard soon ! Facebook and different outlets are full of people who are lying to your face. It doesn’t take a psychologist to see that Karen is not very confident when she speaks . Her speech cadence and the long pauses , taking too much time to think about what to say , so typical for a bullshiter who combines little pieces of truth with large chunks of lies.
    The bad part is that the guys from tasty , instead of being honest and denounce her, they don’t make a sound about her criminality, continuing to promote her ! That’s really messed up. Tasty trade- bad taste in my mouth.

  10. Yeah, but wasn't Sosnoff a trader at Drexel Burnham when Michael Milken was there ? He probably had money well before tasty trade & was able to leverage a lot of it. Who knows what other shady deals were going on back then. Sometimes I get the feeling TT is more of a media company operating in th financial sector then anything else. Case in point, their show "Bootstrapping in America" I can't really even figure out the point of that show.

  11. Hi David, i saw 1 of the intervies with Sykes & Tastytrade. It seemed Tom was trying to expose him, several times he was tellimg him "you are an outlier if you win in penny stocks, most people will not win, its not statisticly possible' he also asked him why he doesnt trade options. I believe he was invited as a form of entertainment if you recall, Tom also brings Jean SImmons from Kiss to show from time time, i believe Tom did not mean to promote Sykes in anyway. As for Karen, in my opinion Tom was just trying to let people know about selling options world as most ppl only know about stocks, such name draws many viewers but then its up to ppl of course to see which strategy works best thru experience. So in my view, Tom did not mean to mislead public.

  12. I would've sworn I saw tom talking to her about some thing in Dallas where they were talking about her being treated like a rock star. I would've sworn that was a recent interview on TastyTrade. This is pretty bizarre. Now she's in some retirement home? What the hell

  13. Hi David , just saw Guruleaks and myself on this video retweeting the topic 😉. You spoken my mind, i use TW but i never follow their suggestion. I 'm annoying about their SPX + other indexes chart which it won't show the Volume or VWAP indicators ! This is queer as if there are Bugs that should be fixed …. Their reason for such phenomen is doubtfully since i even can see Volume and Vwap on Webull platform. I will move if Webull once has built option platform and ready to accept swiss citizen.

  14. I just met her in Chicago. She told me she never loses money selling put spreads. If she is wrong, she said she just rolls it. She mentioned she trades only for herself now. Within the same week, I was at the money show too. Scary to see the garage they teach like penny stocks with T Sykes (although entertaining and dangerous (throwing books to the crowd, mostly elderly), and Elliot wave, etc.

  15. Thanks again David. Funny thing is that her videos right now on the Youtube sidebar of suggested videos while I'm watching this. Her tasty trade videos pop up daily in my recommended videos. Not sure why Tastytrade wouldn't remove these from their site but I guess they are still good promotion for Tastytrade to get newbs onto their service

  16. The funny thing is that they have guests on their show quite frequently, who are called 'Rising Stars'. Those guys are successful traders who have supposedly employed Tastytrade's short premium strategies. However, the interviews usually revolves around what their secrets for success really are.? Why would the "guru" ask questions like that.? If it turns out that they are a lot more successful than Tom himself, it might give credence to your hunch that Tom most likely isn't successful, or mediocre at best…

  17. Wow! I've seen her several times. You're right, Tastyworks brought her on a few times and she was bragging about how she manages 100 million.

    Interesting….

  18. I don't believe Tom S is a successful trader either. His success was from building brokerages and trading-related websites, but I doubt his success has anything to do with being a profitable trader.

  19. The Sykes episodes were attempts to demonstrate the unlikeliness of success using his advocated approaches. The Bruton episodes are Tastytrade being somewhat disingenuous. Sosnoth actually stated that he thought she would eventually blow up with losses.
    Bruton's southern genteel facade masks an attention seeking woman with flexible ethics.

    You are undermining your expose' with your misquoting of her criminal actions. She was not prosecuted for losses, Bruton was fined for taking performance fees out of her client's accounts while they were unearned according to the contractual rules of her fund.

  20. Karen did make lots of money. She blew up selling puts not calls. A market correction took her under. Can't remember which one. Volatility exploded on her. That's what she never equated in her trade plan. She started to fruad investors by hiding the loses by selling more front month puts and using the cash from those puts to hide the loses in current month and still collecting fees from profitability. She created a big snowball that she couldn't get out of. Selling 10 deltas puts can make you money, but if the market crashes your in big trouble. With volatility expanding, those nickels that you pick up can turn into 10 dollar bills basically overnight.

  21. Interesting video. I use tastyworks platform to trade because of its simplicity and low fees. I also felt that the information Karen discussed did not represent the mindset of someone that has a high financial IQ.

    I’m not the sharpest tool in the shed myself but I’m clued in enough to know when something is just not right.

    I don’t watch the bantering of these shows but have watched their educational content on advanced strategies and have found Mike’s Whiteboard segments to be good.

  22. I’m digging a bit deeper into the background story here. This is not to disagree that she’s a fraud, that has been established as a fact. But what are the lessons learnt here?

    Extract from SEC complaint (https://www.sec.gov/litigation/complaints/2016/comp-pr2016-98.pdf):
    E. The Fraudulent Trading Scheme
    58. In October and December 2014, the Funds experienced significant trading losses due to volatility in the financial markets.
    59. In response to these enormous losses, beginning in November 2014 and continuing almost every month to the present, Defendants entered a series of trades (“Scheme Trades”) in the accounts of the HI Fund and the HDB Fund that had the purpose and effect of avoiding realization of the losses.

    She should have just owned up to her losses. Why didn’t she do it?

    Purely speculating on my part here. In some of her videos, she said once she’s received credits, she’s never giving it back. Maybe it was just a figure of speech. Or maybe it’s part of her trading mentality. If it is the latter, while I’m sure it has served her well in all her profits, but it could also be the reason that pushed her to cross an (un)ethical line. Not good. I guess it wouldn’t matter if she just traded for herself. But in this case, she was running a fund and received incentives for it. Not good.

    But profits didn’t go straight to her pocket. I’m sure she and all other employees had a salary, and probably not a small one. But if she started out greedy, she wouldn’t have set it up as a non-profit. She was trying to do good in a developing country. Maybe build a school or something. Maybe the people there depended on her monthly checks and she somehow justified her actions because of that? Who knows, purely speculation here on my part. But if that’s the case, she had good intentions (still not okay to scam her investors though).

    She tries to stay 2 standard deviations away and trade naked because it allows for easier adjustment. A flash crash is still an issue but she said she counter that by having a team watching the market all the time and with strict rules of rolling (at 30 deltas), it wouldn’t be a problem. I guess this whole debacle proves it doesn’t work. David mentioned in some of his videos here he’s starting to trade vertical instead of naked puts in bear market to mitigate the risks. I think that’s smart. In Karen’s case, she didn’t. And because all her positions were mainly concentrated to SPX, RUT and NDX, it was still a concentration of risk (be careful about this David).

    She was a successful trader before she started the fund. In fact, she didn’t just wake up one day and wanted to start a fund. People threw money at her because she was successful and she was reluctant at first. But it’s different trading a 100k account and a 100M account. I’ve always wondered why successful traders aren’t billionaires. But I’m guessing once you get to a certain size you can no longer make the same moves in the market. Orders might be more difficult to fill, you might start to affect prices… whatever. But apart from limits to the account size for the mechanics to work, I believe a major part is the mentality, or the psychology. For Karen, having a fund, employees to care for, and having projects in a developing countries to care for, she suddenly had a lot more mental baggage that affects her decisions. I’ve also seen and read about so many other people becoming successful, started funds, and later blew up their funds. To quote “Trading for a living” by Dr Alexander Elder, there are so many stories of rags to riches and back to rags.

    There a lot of comments around here saying things like “I knew she’s a fraud, I knew she’s a liar, I knew she’s bad at trading”. Superficial. Taking stories at face value. They knew nothing. Yes, she’s a fraud, and she incurred a lot of losses. But regardless of that, there’s so much more to the story to learn from.

  23. I found some nuggets of truth in the interviews….B Bands work sell 2 standard D on pull backs sell 1-2 ratio calls when going up. It isn’t terrible. I’m more aggressive than this.

  24. A problem with Tasty Trade is they subscribe to the notion that "no one knows anything" about price forecasting. As a result they teach and market strategies around this philosophy. There is a science to price movement as the big trading houses follow (elliot wave) but money is more consistently made in small moves intraday with high volume, buying and selling the actual instrument. Options trading isn't built for this without taking on lots of risk, higher priced volatile stocks, buying OTM positions, hoping you have the speed of movement in your favour. Larger moves which occur around earnings seasons have more promise for options to profit with some directional strategies. But in the absence of understanding price direction even an impulse move (which is the one you want, often colloquially speaking a "trend is your friend" movement) will chop you out, due to normal retraces being from 38 to 62% and occur regardless of price divergence on short term timeframes…never mind if the price move is corrective and will turn around quickly after carrying on longer than it seems it should (can't predict it with high degree of certainty, consistently. usually have to wait those out ). So I admit price forecasting is damn near impossible, options trading is not easy either; while there are certain stocks more atuned to being traded sucessfully at certain times. I suspect Ms. Bruton who was a credit spread options trader, on indexes, took greater and greater risks with large positions that were put on closer to the strike price, and as the VIX hovered to all time lows due to very slow moving indexes, for her to garner some premium, they guessed wrong for the time period of the positions. Prices moved against them either up or down compared to the tight option strike credit spreads and the risk of loss can be substantial when price settles somewhere between your credit spread position; even though these are touted as defined risk positions. But I don't know exactly what happened in her /their trades. (sorry for the long winded response).

  25. So if she's moving into a care home because she wants to relieve herself of the "obligation of bills and cooking".
    That's like Bill Gates taking Uber because he hates paying $30 a week for gas…

  26. You know I love your videos but this one is not up to your usual standards. It is my opinion you should prepare before you make the podcast. You are thinking out loud, learning and reading while making the podcast. I am really surprised because you usually know your stuff. You also were playing audio of her and speaking at the same time. Constructive criticism I hope:). You are a favorite of mine, please keep the information coming:) Respectfully, Robert

  27. I just found your channel, and recently i have been trying to learn all i can about trading options – There is ALOT of obviously bad info out there and much more that I am not yet smart enough to separate from the good/truthful info. Some people have a strategy that they like/are comfortable with and works for them to some extent.
    And others that are just trying to scam you.
    You seem genuine – So my question is: Is selling Puts the majority of your option investing strategy? Thanks for your time.

  28. Good video and thanks for exposing these frauds….serious question, I know you like selling options but what do you think about dividend investing. Honestly have been considering it. If you have like 15k and just put it into a well establish dividend paying stock and never sell and then each dividend payment you take half to reinvest and half to pay back the initial investment, in the long run, this will essentially give you great returns each dividend payment once your initial investment is reimbursed..heck you could even just reinvest all the dividend payment and then periodically pull your initial investment out in chunks….seems safer and less stressful and compounds itself over time. Just never sell…

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